featured interview:

Iron & Wine

A conversation with

Sam Beam

(October 2005)

In his two EPs this year—Woman King and the recently released collaboration with Calexico, In the Reins—Sam Beam has shown no interest in settling into a comfortable routine or stock Iron & Wine sound.  Drawing from sources near and far, Beam continues to expand the possibilities of his future catalog, leaving his many imitators scrambling to keep up.

Hanging out at home prior to a jaunt out west with Calexico, the affable songwriter and Southern man chats about the merits of EPs and film schools, fields some questions about specific influences on his songs, and gives Hollywood just a glimmer a hope.

With In The Reins, how did the song selection work?  Did you decide on doing an album with Calexico first and then go back to find the songs that would be right for the collaboration?

Yeah, it went along those lines.  I knew that we were going to do this project, and I threw some stuff together that made the least sense.  (laughs)  No, I knew I wanted to do the “In The Reins” song with them because I thought it would be served pretty well by their Southwest style. 

Had you played shows together?  How did you know it was going to work?

Well, I didn’t!  The fella that’s putting out this record, Howard Greynolds on this label Overcoat, he’s a mutual friend of ours.  I started talking to him about the same time I started talking to Sub Pop about that first record.  One of the ideas we had thrown about was not releasing the home recording stuff, but having Calexico come and be my backing band.  That never worked out, but we kept it in the back of our heads—and we finally did it. 

Was it a pretty complete overhaul of the songs?  I assume the lyrics stayed mostly intact?

Yeah, pretty much.  Most of the songs were changed significantly; some of them are very, very similar with just a little added instrumentation.  I threw out some of the lyrics here and there.

I know it’s not unusual for you to go back to songs you’d written a while ago.  Is this the first time you did that with this level of collaboration?

Yeah.  But I kind of do it with my band quite a bit, too.  I think it’s fun.  I mean, honestly it gets pretty fucking old playing those songs over and over again.  You know, anything you can do to spice it up is always fun.

Sure.  Now I read a number of reviews that said things like “In The Reins is a great starting point, a promising first chapter.”  Is there a thought that there will be more chapters?  I know you’re touring together, but are you considering approaching another album?

No, I don’t think so.  Nothing planned.  It was kind of approached as a one-off thing.

Percussion is becoming more and more of a signature in your songs.  Is there a lot of direct external influence on your songwriting from music you listen to, like the African music that you enjoy?

Oh, yeah.  You know, among other things, but, yeah, for sure.

Was there someone that turned you on to that, or was it something that you sought out on your own?

Um, I’ve always liked music, and I’ve always liked a variety of music, but there have been people who pointed me to certain things—like a guy I played with pointed me toward Ali Farka Toure.

For someone who isn’t well-versed in that genre, what would be a good entry point?

Well, Ali Farka Toure is probably your best bet.  It’s amazing—and at the same time, you can hear a blues sentiment about it.

I went through a creative writing program in college, and there were the two warring camps—the one that said writing must be forced, and the other that said writing can’t be forced.  Do you subscribe to either side? 

Mine is kind of a synthesis of both of those, honestly.  I do sit down at some point every day, usually in the morning, and make a discipline of it. But if it’s not working, you have to be honest with yourself and go and do something else.  David Byrne actually said something about that.  He said it’s kind of like catching the bus; if you’re not at the bus stop, you’re not going to catch the bus.

How hard has that been as a father?  I would think it would make it harder to hang out at the bus stop.

It definitely does!  But when they go to school, I get to work. 

It can be easy for those artistic pursuits to take a backseat for parents.

Yeah, it’s a huge responsibility. 

You’ve said that when it comes time for an album, you go back through the songs you’ve written.  Do you keep mental stacks of songs that are ripe for reworking versus songs that you never want to touch again?  Is there a discard pile?

(chuckles)  You know, it’s not really an organized thing.  I just play on through, and if something is sticking with me, I keep working it.

Approximately how many songs would you say you have in surplus?

(pause)  Probably about 75 to 100.  They’re all in different stages of completion, but I was doing it for quite a while before the first record came out.  Then there is always stuff that doesn’t get put out on the releases.

Why EPs, then, when you have all that material?  Is it a matter of songs fitting together?

Well, one, I like ‘em.  I like short records, so a super-short record is even more fun.

As a listener? 

As a listener, for sure.  I like things that you can take in one sitting.  So the EPs are fun.  It also has a lot to do with the current state of distribution.  You have to put so much energy into a full-length that it really doesn’t make much sense to put more than one out every three years or something.  It’s a matter of oversaturation.  I like to keep working and keep putting stuff out.

The downside is that there are some who, for whatever reason, don’t take EPs as seriously.

Yeah.  I think if it’s interesting, some people are going to pay attention, but they are easier to overlook.

Jumping back to Woman King, I’d read that the title song was a reaction against “male posturing” in the news.  What timeframe are we talking about?  What’s the posturing?

It was right before the Iraq war.  The whole thing with Korea was going on at the same time.

It seems like we have somewhat similar histories and subsequent fascinations with religion.  As someone who’s interested in the role it plays in society, do you think that its influence is about to wane?  Or still increase?

Oh, I don’t know.  (laughs)  Right now you’ve got this point where a lot people don’t want it, but the people who do—there’s a lot more contradiction going on at the forefront than when everyone was like, “Yeah, church, right.  Got it!”

Have you ever taken any backlash from friends or family for asking questions in those sensitive areas?

Well…no, I think most of my friends and family kind of know where I come from.  (chuckles)  They might not like it, but they’re not really surprised.

I wanted to talk about a specific image or lyric that stands out in a disturbing manner—jumping back to “Teeth in the Grass.”  Was that title line drawn from somewhere or is that one of those things that was kind of just pulled out of the ether?

Yeah, it was kind of an ethereal kind of thing.  Tonally, it’s bleaker than most of the stuff I like to write.  But I was just trying to make an image that, despite all these great things that happen in the verses—we can be brothers, everyone is fed—there’s this unsettling factor.  (chuckles)  The teeth in the grass.

Your name frequently appears as a reference point in the press kits of other bands and songwriters.  Do you hear a lot of kindred spirits?

Yeah, I guess so.  I don’t know—I don’t really get out a whole lot, but there is the whole to-do about the whole folk revival thing.  I think there are a lot of people interested in writing songs again. 

Not much time to be a music fan these days, then?

Oh, yeah, I still love music.  I definitely don’t have as much time to just sit and listen to records as I used to, but that has more to do with parenthood.  I do my listening in the car these days.  (laughs)

Has your eldest gotten to the age yet where you can play records for her?

No.  Well, she’s probably old enough—I just don’t think she’s that interested.  She likes sports and stuff.

Were you a music fan at an early age?

Yeah, I always liked it—but among other things.

Did it start as a reaction against something, like it does for a lot of kids?

I think eventually, yeah, when you start worrying about social groups and finding identities and that sort of stuff.  I always gravitated toward music.

Since I’m in L.A., I wanted to close by talking about film, naturally.  Did you have a positive experience in film school, as a student and instructor?

I loved film school.  I think I like it even more in hindsight.  It’s really the only chance you’re ever going to have to do whatever you want and learn from your mistakes.  There’s a level of it that’s so hypothetical and [lacking] real, working world scenarios, but I think it’s a great starting place. 

How about the ol’ screenwriting career?  Do you ever write a song and think, “Man, this would be a great script?”

Uh…  Well, at the moment, I’m kind of busy...but… (laughs)

— Interview by Adam McKibbin

www.ironandwine.com

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Destroyer - Destroyer's Rubies

Calexico - Garden Ruin

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